super swift dry fire issue

Another biathlon sidelever style shooter, with automatic return (FX6000). Also known as FX Superswift and Logun Dominator.

super swift dry fire issue

Postby kenkad on Tue Sep 17, 2013 6:36 pm

Hello,
I have a FX Super Swift. Apparently, there was a very small leak in the fill port valve of the cylinder and the cylinder leaked down and the result was a dry fire. I got a replacement valve from Airguns of Arizona and repaired the cylinder. Then when I placed the cylinder into the airgun, the air now leaks out near the cylinder exit valve. I obtained a parts list/drawing for the Cutlas and now decided to see if the #17-#23 valve parts were damaged. There does not appear to be any damage, especially to the chamfered end of the main valve pin or the opposite end that is restrained by the spring. I do not see any easy way to remove the part #17 and #18. I do not see any issue with the O-ring, part #26. Since this issue happened immediately after the dry fire, I have to assume that the dry fire was the cause.

In order to remove part #17 and #18, does the hammer and hammer spring have to be removed and then some small diameter rod inserted to push out valve seat and O-ring? I have looked for any videos that show how this is done and there do not appear to be any. If I remember correctly, Airguns of Arizona suggested connecting a high pressure scuba cylinder (not use the hand pump) and pressurize the airgun cylinder to try to reset the main valve pin. Since removing the main valve pin was not very difficult, I did that instead to see if there was any damage. Since there does not appear to be any damage, I do not understand the suggestion of using a scuba tank as a high volume pressurization. I cannot even find out what parts come in the main valve pin repair kit. I have even tried to contact FXairguns directly and got absolutely no response.

Thanks for any help. I am near Huntsville, AL, USA.
kenkad
kenkad
 
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Re: super swift dry fire issue

Postby kenkad on Mon Oct 07, 2013 4:57 pm

Hello,
So there has been no response to the initial thread. I want to update the thread to say that I am making a fitting that can be used in place of the air cylinder. The fitting will have a M12x1 female thread on one end (this is what I measured it to be) and a pipe thread on the opposite end. This will allow me to test the o-ring and seal integrity of the receiver section, minus the issue of the o-ring in the air cylinder end. That o-ring does not appear to be damaged or degraded and yet the air cylinder leaks out immediately when it is screwed in.

It is hard for me to appreciate that FX nor anyone else has made available such an adapter (coupling) for testing with a 200psi compressor source. At least this will allow leak testing so I do not have to be disassembling parts that have potentially have no bearing on the current problem.

It is also hard to appreciate that no FX distriibutors/sales representatives have responded to my emails (Sweden, USA or UK) to them to help resolve this issue. As an older person, I detest buying a product and then finding out that it might have a design problem that is never present upfront before the sale and is only mention in the owner's manual, AFTER, you buy the product.

If anyone would like to volunteer the name of a contact person at FX that would respond to this issue, I would really appreciate it.
kenkad
kenkad
 
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Re: super swift dry fire issue

Postby karlpv on Wed Oct 09, 2013 5:58 am

Ooops. I meant to respond this a day or two after you posted. Needed to gather the parts for a picture, and it slipped my mind. :oops: Sounds like your enjoying some of the A of A famous post-sale service and support. ;) Before you machine up an adapter ..... (lot of work and expense!!!)
FX.jpg
FX.jpg (248.84 KiB) Viewed 6828 times

Here's some of the parts in question. Your post seemed to state the leaking air is coming from around the tube adapter area. Based on that, I would guess the most likely candidates are either # 26, or # 24, the pressure sealing washer. 26 is in behind the female adapter threads, and notoriously difficult to change. Including me, most cave and replace with a 70 duro, but specs are for a 90 duro. A 70 does seem to work, but likely would fail after a number of full pressure tube removals. Try a large needle or scriber for a tool to stab into the old one for getting out. I have a couple of pressure-sealing-washers / dowdy seals in the top of the picture. The larger is 1/2". I don't recall if I used one of these successfully or not. I couldn't locate metric. I had planned to make up a brass washer to contain an oring here, but never got around to it.

All the valve stems I have are very concentric. You should be able to roll yours on as smooth surface and quickly spot any run-out, indicating a bend. The middle one pictured is the valve tube unit by the way. The valve seats are easiest to remove by getting behind them as you surmised. I was able to get at least one out by hooking the step with something. Use due care to avoid scratching or nicking anything, if you don't have replacement in hand. And the oring on the seat (# 18) is one of the very few I've found in which a SAE equivalent will not work; metric a must. Good luck.
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Location: California, USA

Re: super swift dry fire issue

Postby kenkad on Fri Oct 11, 2013 9:45 pm

karlpv,
Thank you for responding. I do not believe that the problem is #26. The adapter I will make (waiting for M12x1 taps to arrive) will determine absolutely if #26 is the issue. The reason, as I stated before, that I do not believe #26 is the problem is because the leaking started immediately after the dry fire and the replacement of the fill end Oring on the cylinder. Obviously, the cylinder pumps up just fine now.

I have my own lathe so making the adapter is not a problem, just had to get the M12x1 taps. What I am concerned about is that #17 and #18 are the culprits. There is no description of how to get these out (I suspect the firing pin assembly has to be removed). I just wish that someone would at least describe how this is all done. What is so secretive about all this? Finally, I could not even get any response from any distributor or FX as to how to get replacement parts! Will I every buy FX again? You know the answer to that.

By the way, #24 is typically used in high pressure washers. With the adpater, I will quickly know if that is the problem.
kenkad
kenkad
 
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Re: super swift dry fire issue

Postby karlpv on Tue Oct 15, 2013 7:18 am

Yes, to get the valve seat and its oring out # 17, 18 out, you need to remove the threaded air tube adapter. After removing, the valve and its return spring are right there in the receiver. As I said above, I removed the seat t least once from that side without damage. It sits in a counterbore in the receiver, about the flush as I recall. I'm pretty sure there's a small step to hook. The altervative is splitting the two receiver halves to get behind it. That's a three handed operation getting all back together with the detents and cocking lever, but you're likely capable if you're making your own pressure fitting! Here's an attempt at picturing the back side of a valve seat in place; in this case a tube. The exhaust one is similar as I remember.

Many of these rifles and tubes are getting to be over ten years old and the buena orings start suffering the effects of age and chemicals. Some of mine have been well riddled with cracks. I try and replace with Viton, believing it to have better aging qualities.
Seat2.jpg
Seat2.jpg (94.15 KiB) Viewed 6786 times
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